Talk:Dummer's War: Difference between revisions

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Grey Lock's War should be merged here. It's not that long, and its content is mostly already replicated here. Magic♪piano 23:38, 1 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agree, as it appears that most of the information is already here. It should have a separate heading to distinguish it from the rest of the raids. Mannanan51 (talk) 03:22, 9 November 2012 (UTC)Mannanan51[reply]

I disagree! This war was separate and not related to Father Rale in Maine. As an Abenaki, I strongly disagree with you!--Donnacona (talk) 01:01, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps you'd like to explain (with reference to appropriate sources, and not an appeal to ethnicity), how and why it is not related. Magic♪piano 01:46, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It's easy to explain, Grey Lock was in present day Vermont, Father Rale was in Northeastern Maine. No telephones or cellphones back then. It is a historical mistake to give so much credit to Father Rale. Grey Lock acted on his own. We all know that! White men are always trying to deform history as they did for the Battle of Little Big Horn.--Donnacona (talk) 04:20, 2 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Furthermore, it seems that Native Americans cannot do anything on their own, they need a white man to tell them what to do. It's like the justice system who seems to think that a woman cannot make her own decisions, a man had to tell her what to do. Same conceited belittlement.--Donnacona (talk) 04:52, 2 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Father Rale died in 1724, and the war ended in 1725; but Grey Lock continued for another two years. So you will leave that out to make it fit your assumptions. Why don't you read this: [1]!--Donnacona (talk) 05:39, 2 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Just because Grey Lock and the Maine natives are not known to have communicated in person doesn't mean their actions where neither coordinated nor related. Communication was slow then but that does not mean it did not take place. However, far be it from me to suggest that Rale be given great credit; I actually agree that colonial chroniclers greatly overstated his role (because they couldn't conceive of the natives taking action without French support or machination), and that misconception bled into the historical record (as exemplified in part by the current name of this article). Grey Lock started his campaign at about the same time as other hostilities commenced; his continuation of the war is easy to explain: he was not part of the 1725 peace, and probably only stopped fighting because he was starved of support by the French and those who had made peace. (And I'll thank you to not make assumptions about what I or other editors assume, think, or do. Kindly stick to the subject.) Magic♪piano 18:41, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

We already have articles on Northeast Coast Campaign (1723), Battle of Norridgewock, Battle of Winnepang and Battle of Pequawket, which are all, per their infoboxes, part of Father Rale's War. But Grey Lock's War is part of Anglo-Wabanaki War. Why should they be merged if it's not even part of the same war? If it is indeed part of the same war, why can't it have its own article, as the other battles do? Wbm1058 (talk) 03:02, 3 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The article has clearly gone beyond Class=start. It appears to deserve a "B" rating today, IMO. PKT(alk) 16:21, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Sir, author, etc. In reading the the article which you most kindly contributed to the vast wealth of knowledge in Wikipedia, I have encountered an accusation. The Accusation is as follows: "While most of the tribe was away hunting, Westbrook's 300 soldiers surrounded Norridgewock to capture Rale, but he was forewarned and escaped into the forest. Found among the priest's possessions, however, was his strongbox. In it was discovered a hidden compartment containing letters implicating Rale as an agent of the French government, promising Indians enough ammunition to drive the English from their settlements." Against these most atrocious charges I bring the following defenses: 1. If the said strongbox did contain letters promising Indians enough ammunition to drive the English from their settlements, might this passage, "to drive the English from their settlements" been a comparison, rather than a use of these weapons? 2. If the said passage indeed was a use for which the weapons were to have been sent, might this have not been for the purpose of protecting the Indians from the obvious aggression and bigotry of the English settlers? 3. According to the narrative of Chicago EDU, this strongbox contained no other thing but Lexicography and personal letters. I will also note that the site to which this detail refers says nothing of the said letters itself; that is, the letters implicating Fr. Rale as a French agent

These arguments I bring forth in the defense of Father Sebastian Rale. Yours, etc. Indignant, Adam Swift — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.180.165.38 (talk) 18:23, 31 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

It has been proposed in this section that Dummer's War be renamed and moved to Father Rale's War. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. Links: current log • target log • direct move

Anglo-Wabanaki War → Father Rale's War – Was moved to Anglo-Wabanaki War to correct fallacies of that period...this is not our job....we are here to regurgitate what the sources say...not to fix history. There are many conflicts called " Anglo-Wabanaki war" so this title is misleading. A Google search for "Anglo-Wabanaki War " leads to nothing/...that said "Drummer's War" would be ok with me as per the sources. Moxy (talk) 17:49, 20 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Support move to either Father Rale's War or Dummer's War, the names by which it is most often referenced. No sources have been presented that support the recent move to the present name. Magic♪piano 17:56, 20 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]
• AgainstThere are many articles that prove that he was not the instigator to these attacks but that he tried to stop them. The first time his legs were broken and he had a hard time to walk after that. Here are a few articles that were found on the internet: http://maineanencyclopedia.com/rasle-sebastian/; http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1885208/posts; http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Journals/CHR/1/2/Sebastian_Rale*.html; http://college.holycross.edu/faculty/vlapomar/jesuits.htm. If the present title is accepted, we would not need to separate Grey Lock's War from Father Rale's War. Furthermore, in French, the article carries this title as well.--Donnacona (talk) 20:00, 20 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]