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This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to Businesspeople. It is one of many deletion lists coordinated by WikiProject Deletion sorting. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.

Adding a new AfD discussion
Adding an AfD to this page does not add it to the main page at WP:AFD. Similarly, removing an AfD from this page does not remove it from the main page at WP:AFD. If you want to nominate an article for deletion, go through the process on that page before adding it to this page. To add a discussion to this page, follow these steps:
  1. Edit this page and add {{Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PageName}} to the top of the list. Replace "PageName" with the relevant article name, i.e. the one on the existing AFD discussion. Also, indicate the title of the article in the edit summary as it is particularly helpful to add a link to the article in the edit summary. When you save the page, the discussion will automatically appear.
  2. You should also tag the AfD by adding {{subst:delsort|Businesspeople|~~~~}} to it, which will inform editors that it has been listed here. You may place this tag above or below the nomination statement or at the end of the discussion thread.
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Removing a closed AfD discussion
Closed AfD discussions are automatically removed by a bot.
Other types of discussions
You can also add and remove other discussions (prod, CfD, TfD etc.) related to Businesspeople. For the other XfD's, the process is the same as AfD (except {{Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/PageName}} is used for MFD and {{transclude xfd}} for the rest). For PRODs, adding a link with {{prodded}} will suffice.
Further information
For further information see Wikipedia's deletion policy and WP:AfD for general information about Articles for Deletion, including a list of article deletions sorted by day of nomination.


Archived discussions (starting from September 2007) may be found at:
Purge page cache watch

This list is included in more general lists of business-related deletions and people for deletion.

See also: Businesses for deletion.

Businesspeople

[edit]

Harry M. Rubin

[edit]
Harry M. Rubin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Upon review of article and its sources, the person in question does not meet the notability guidelines in question: the person is not (1) cited by 3rd party sources other than websites that repeat his bio as an official founder of Samuel Adams beer (2) known for originating a new concept [see point #1] (3) become a significant monument, etc. (4) He is not cited as by peers and 3rd party sources for the work that is well-known or significant. The article was written by a blocked user and could primarily serve the purpose of self promotion as defined in WP:NOTADVERT. P3D7AQ09M6 (talk)

Benjamin Benedict Apugo

[edit]
Benjamin Benedict Apugo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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An article about a politician that doesn't meet WP:NPOL. Endorsing politicians, and speaking on TV can make you appear on the news but the coverage may be your statements and quotes; same issue here. I want a community consensus on this. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 01:48, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hiba Farès

[edit]
Hiba Farès (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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non notable, written by an undisclosed paid editor, sources are terrible Polygnotus (talk) 21:14, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Tariq Chauhan

[edit]
AfDs for this article:
Tariq Chauhan (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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In its current form, this biography of a living person makes no reference to anything that is said by third parties about the subject, and so does not satisfy general notability. The one reference is a press release which makes a passing mention of the subject, which is not independent coverage or secondary coverage. It states that the subject is the co-founder of EFS Facilities Services Group, but an article on that group has been deleted for lack of corporate notability, so there is no good redirect target. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:10, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Businesspeople, Companies, and India. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:10, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Written by a just-barely-autoconfirmed sleeper as copyright infringement from a press release. After that was stubbified, revdelled, and draftified and nobody was looking anymore, he pasted the same material back in, where it lasted until the past few hours. Should be speediable, and the only reason it isn't is because we let the good-hand socks of paid editors vote against reasonable countermeasures against advertising even as obvious as this. And, btw, EFS Facilities Group wasn't just deleted, it's currently heading very rapidly towards a blacklisting at DRV. —Cryptic 19:26, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Sources in the bad revision—special:permalink/1187098514:
Source assessment table:
Source Independent? Reliable? Significant coverage? Count source toward GNG?
Pupic, Tamara (July 17, 2018). "Impact At Scale: Tariq Chauhan, Group CEO, EFS Facilities Services Group". Entrepreneur. No Statements come from the subject. No Churnalism. ? Has volume but a volume of churnalism is not a volume of significant coverage. ✘ No
Chauhan, Tariq (May 5, 2019). "The How-To: Family Relationships In A Business Setting". Entrepreneur. No WP:SPS of the WP:FORBESCON type + author is the subject. No WP:SPS No Self-published material is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
Staff Report. "EFS Group forays into its food and beverage business". Khaleej Times. No Repackaged press release sourced from the company of which the subject is CEO. No No Routine. ✘ No
East, Forbes Middle. "Top 50 Indian Executives In The Arab World 2018". Forbes ME. ? ? No No meaningful coverage. ✘ No
"Union Budget 2023-24: India goes for growth, slashes income tax". gulfnews.com. February 2023. No Churnalistic quote farm. No Can not be used to support any claims about the subject. No A quote of the subject of a biography is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
"Gulf's facilities management services keep getting shortchanged". gulfnews.com. 16 February 2022. No WP:SPS of the WP:FORBESCON type + author is the subject. No No Self-published material is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
John, Issac. "Sheikh Mohamed is the new President; excitement, expectations abound as UAE pivots to new era of growth". Khaleej Times. No Sycophantic-churnalistic quote farm. No insource:khaleejtimes gives thousands of results—something to think about. No A quote of the subject of a biography is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
Fernandez, Keith J. (April 14, 2022). "Ramadan 2022: how UAE residents are paying it forward". The National. No The material pertaining to the subject is a self-aggrandizing statement from the perspective of the company of which he is CEO. No nope No not ✘ No
"The younger generation is getting it wrong on work-life balance". gulfnews.com. 6 November 2022. No WP:SPS of the WP:FORBESCON type + author is the subject. No No Self-published material is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
"With risk and debt, business owners have to walk a fine line". gulfnews.com. 8 January 2023. No WP:SPS of the WP:FORBESCON type + author is the subject. No No Self-published material is not *coverage* for it to be able to qualify as significant coverage. ✘ No
East, Forbes Middle. "EFS Facilities Services Group". Forbes ME. No Paid "Brandvoice" section. No Paid content. No Ads are not coverage. ✘ No
"Winners Revealed for the Innovation in FM Awards 2022". Construction Business News Middle East. 2022-06-13. Retrieved 2023-05-04. ? Yes Subject won the non-notable award. No Just a mention. Evidence of a non-notable award. ✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.
WP:BEFORE does not reveal any further usable sources.
Delete per the source analysis and my BEFORE which did not yield any other sources that could demonstrate notability.—Alalch E. 21:18, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep I dont have a problem if the article is deleted if it has no merit. But why was the article blanked out just before the deletion nomination.

This a not a fair review process for deletion as the article was blanked out just before nomination.

Is this some kind of bullying thats going on? The guy is a billionaire and was voted as one of the most powerful businessman in the middle east multiple times.

I can find atleast a million article on wikipedia with not even 1/10th of his notability without any notifications whatsoever. This culture of selective bullying and harassment should stop(2409:4073:4EB1:118F:2D94:5D9B:3BCF:B604 (talk) 12:08, 19 July 2024 (UTC))[reply]

Edgar Chibaka

[edit]
Edgar Chibaka (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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should be deleted due to the lack of significant independent coverage that meets the General Notability Guideline (GNG), relying instead on primary sources, company related news and not significant mentions. LusikSnusik (talk) 10:22, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Glenn Elliott (politician)

[edit]
Glenn Elliott (politician) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Non-notable local official and U.S. Senate candidate. All sources cited on the page are WP:ROTM coverage of his mayorship and Senate campaign. No real in-depth coverage of him as a person, and no indication that either his campaign or mayoral administration were considered especially notable by media outlets. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 17:35, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Microplastic Consumer: Wheeling has a population under 30,000. The fact that it happens to be one of the largest cities in WV is irrelevant, being the mayor of a relatively small community does not establish notability. Please familiarize yourself with WP:NPOL.BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 00:56, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Kindly refrain from suggesting that other contributors have not read the relevant policies. There is no policy stating how large the population of a city must be for its mayor to be notable, and there are other factors here, because the subject is a major party nominee for national office—not, as you suggest below, the state legislature. P Aculeius (talk) 03:19, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@P Aculeius: Please familiarize yourself with WP:NPOL, which states that "just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability." I heavily disagree that Elliott is guaranteed to receive in-depth national coverage, and even if that were true, it still wouldn't be a valid argument--we can't maintain a Wikipedia page on the basis that the subject might eventually become notable. Also, it should have been obvious that "the WV Senate page" meant the page for the 2024 Senate race in WV. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 04:56, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please familiarize yourself with WP:NPA before you tell people that they need to read policies they're already familiar with—as you've already done twice in this conversation. There are perfectly legitimate reasons for disagreeing with you besides pure ignorance. And it's not at all obvious that you knew what you were talking about, since "the WV Senate page" presumably refers to the page about the West Virginia Senate.
U.S. Senate races are not "run of the mill" items of no interest to most readers; that suggestion is not worthy of rebuttal. And I wasn't referring to potential future coverage, but to current and prior coverage. Mayors of major cities in a state and U.S. Senate races tend to generate a fair amount of news coverage; your nomination suggests that you haven't looked beyond the currently cited sources, which would mean that the nomination doesn't comply with WP:BEFORE.
You seem to be under the impression that only national news sources are relevant, while the Wheeling Intelligencer is not; but that is one of the main newspapers in the state, and in excluding its coverage from consideration, you're the one applying non-existent standards to reach a conclusion of non-notability. The notability guidelines expressly state that state and local politicians may be notable; they do not say that their notability depends on the existence or quantity of nationwide coverage. P Aculeius (talk) 05:38, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@P Aculeius: Your interpretation of the rules seems to be that any mayor of a small city or U.S. Senate nominee is automatically notable. I'm not sure where you're getting that from. AfDs for local officials and U.S. Senate candidates succeed very frequently. Just off the top of my head: here's an AfD where a mayor of a city the same size as Wheeling lost his Wikipedia page, and here's an AfD where the GOP Senate nominee in Montana lost his Wikipedia page (and the Montana race is much more competitive than the WV race). Both of those examples are very recent and show that your interpretation of the rules is not shared by the wider community of editors. If you want, I could cite plenty more examples. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 07:41, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, I didn't say that "any mayor of a small city is automatically notable"; I said that "this two-term mayor of one of West Virginia's largest cities who is now the Democratic nominee for U.S. Senate is sufficiently notable to keep." Please don't speak for me or, for that matter, for other editors—let them express their own opinions.
This article is not comparable to "Manny Cid", who is only one of eight candidates running for mayor of Miami-Dade County, having previously served as mayor of the unincorporated town of Miami Lakes, the 89th largest city in Florida, which has a council-manager government. There as here, the argument that local news coverage cannot be used to establish notability was made, and refuted. Why it's being asserted again here defies all reason. Some of those who voted to merge that article into the 2024 mayoral election for Miami-Dade County indicated that he would be sufficiently notable if he won—and became mayor.
It is more comparable to the example of Tim Sheehy, but with key differences: Sheehy is the operator of a small company in Montana that fights fires with planes and drones, not the two-term mayor of one of Montana's largest cities. The main contributor to the article had a close connection with the subject, while the second-biggest contributor concurred with redirection. Glenn Elliott has news coverage dating back to 2016 already cited in this article. P Aculeius (talk) 12:38, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Both of the Defeated Candidates Zach Shrewsbury and Don Blankenship have pages. 2603:301F:2801:7C00:7437:901D:45CC:C3B5 (talk) 13:31, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This argument is completely irrelevant and not really even worth consideration. Also, this IP user's only edits are on this deletion discussion. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 19:59, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
BottleofChoclateMilk, WP:WHATABOUT applies to you mentioning the two other deletions. The subject has the WP:3SOURCES from AP, The Hill, and The Intelligencer
Manny Cid has a fraction of the coverage as Elliott, and is from a much larger state too. 30,000 people in Florida is tiny while 30,000 in West Virginia can be considered a large city. Microplastic Consumer (talk) 14:21, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@P Aculeius: I don't know where you got this idea that a mayor of a small city is automatically notable if that city happens to be located in a small state. That just doesn't make any sense. The Hill article you cited is WP:ROTM coverage, while the AP article is a little better but not proof of notability. Also, U.S. Senate nominees are not automatically notable; again, you are depicting your personal interpretation of the rules as fact. See also Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hung Cao (2nd nomination), where numerous editors used "U.S. Senate nominees are not automatically notable" as their reasons for favoring deletion. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 19:59, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I repeat—stop putting words in people's mouths. Nobody in this discussion has said either of the things that you keep repeating ad nauseam. I didn't cite any articles either, so stop telling me that what I didn't say can be ignored for reasons A, B, and C. You also shouldn't be relying on WP:ROTM as though it were policy; it's only an essay. And this race has significant national implications, since its outcome will help determine whether the Republican Party is able to gain control of the U.S. Senate. The coverage is not, "person nobody's ever heard of announces candidacy," but "prominent national figure endorses candidate for his successor; control of U.S. Senate hangs in balance". So this is far from "run of the mill", even if that were a policy—which it's not.
You should learn to respect other people whose opinions on how policies apply to a set of facts differ from yours, and to accept that yours isn't the only valid point of view. If other people disagree, it doesn't mean that you need to keep bludgeoning them with the same arguments over and over, as though you can negate someone's opinion by explaining that they're wrong and just don't understand the rules as well as you do. P Aculeius (talk) 02:12, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@P Aculeius: You're making an argument that the Senate race is notable, not an argument that Elliott is notable. Every Senate election in history fits the definition of "will help determine whether the Republican Party is able to gain control of the U.S. Senate." Have Elliott or his campaign received extensive, in-depth coverage? If he loses, will people still be searching for him in 10 years? Your uncivil, angry tone isn't helping your argument. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 02:46, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Seriously, just stop—I already said I considered the facts sufficient to satisfy notability, I explained why when you argued I was wrong, and I replied to your arguments when you insisted I was wrong to continue to disagree with you. You're just not listening: you can't negate people's opinions by telling them why you think they're wrong over and over. Stop telling people they need to read the policy, stop putting words in their mouths, stop filling the discussion with straw men, and stop pinging people every time you reply, as though nobody can be expected to check on a discussion they're participating in. I gave my reasons, and I don't need to keep doing it over and over and argue with every reply you keep adding without anything changing. P Aculeius (talk) 02:55, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Dear lord, calm down. Again, it's hard to have a civil discussion with someone who gets blisteringly angry over nothing. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 04:22, 20 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Girish Tanti

[edit]
Girish Tanti (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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WP:NOTRESUME. Fails WP:GNG WP:BASIC. Initially, I tried to draftify the page, but there is already a rejected draft in existence. Charlie (talk) 15:41, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hubertus van der Vaart

[edit]
Hubertus van der Vaart (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Have carried out WP:BEFORE for this unreferenced article about a businessperson, and not found independent, reliable sources to add. I don't think he meets WP:GNG, WP:NBUSINESSPEOPLE or WP:ANYBIO. Tacyarg (talk) 11:23, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Celebrations4u

[edit]
Celebrations4u (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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All the sources mentioned in the article are part of regular brand promotions/ interviews/ PRs. No significant coverage from independent sources. Fails GNG Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 10:54, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Julian Adyeri Omalla

[edit]
Julian Adyeri Omalla (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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not notable per WP ANYBIO guidelines. Possible original research and WP Resume. Old-AgedKid (talk) 09:28, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Businesspeople, Women, and Uganda. Shellwood (talk) 10:10, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: The article currently has three sources with significant coverage, one of which is United Nations News, which refers to Omalla as "one of the most decorated female entrepreneurs in Uganda". Feel free to fix OR/CV issues, but I don't think notability is the issue here.

Kirill Ilinski

[edit]
Kirill Ilinski (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Fails WP:BIO. Despite looking like a lot of sources, 16 of the 32 sources are simply scientific articles by the subject. Google news comes up with 1 hit. And the company he founded Fusion Asset Management is up for deletion. LibStar (talk) 04:21, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep the article (and possibly edit or amend)
I strongly oppose the deletion of the article on Kirill Ilinski for the following reasons:
1. Significant Academic Contributions:
  • Kirill Ilinski has authored over 40 scientific articles in the field of quantitative finance, which have been cited by numerous peers, showcasing his influence and recognition within the academic community.
  • He has written two notable books, one of which was nominated as the best business book by PWC, underscoring the importance and recognition of his work in the business community.
2. Notable Industry Presence:
  • Ilinski regularly speaks at prominent industry conferences and events, indicating his role as a thought leader in his field. His lectures at St. Petersburg European University are among the most viewed on Lektorium.tv, demonstrating his impact on education and knowledge dissemination.
3. Research on Climate Adaptation:
  • Ilinski's ongoing research on climate adaptation, which is not yet public, holds potential for significant contributions to how governments can prepare for climate change. His recent co-authored paper, "TOWARDS THE THEORY OF FIRM'S ESG TRANSFORMATION: ESG READINESS," has been listed on SSRN's Top Ten download list, further validating his active and impactful research contributions.
4. Media References and Coverage:
  • While Google News may show limited hits, a comprehensive search on Google reveals multiple references and articles in reputable sources such as the Financial Times, Hedge Fund Journal, Bloomberg, Hedgeweek etc. (as well as events where he participated as a speaker). These publications highlight his professional achievements and contributions to the finance industry.
5. Independent Sources:
  • There are number of independent references that establish Ilinski's notability. For example, coverage in renowned financial publications and his academic contributions cited by other researchers demonstrate independent recognition of his work
If certain sections of the article do not comply with Wikipedia's policies, they can be revised or updated to meet the guidelines. Deleting the article would be an extreme measure, especially considering the potential for improvement and the significant content that does meet Wikipedia's standards. Constructive feedback and specific suggestions for improvement would be appreciated, rather than opting for deletion, which would not only undermine the comprehensive representation of his work but also limit the availability of valuable information to the public.
Also, I want to point out that Wikipedia articles for Kirill Ilinski and the company he founded - Fusion Asset Management where on Wikipedia for more then 10 years, and no one ever questioned their compliance with Wikipedia policy.
The fact that both pages were nominated for deletion (instead of suggesting improvements) just within 2 days, make me think that this is a commercially motivated attack. Tarasrybak888 (talk) 15:15, 17 July 2024 (UTC) [reply]
Note: Tarasrybak888 (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
@Tarasrybak888: Please disclose your relation to the company Fusion Asset Management, per Wikipedia rules of Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. - Altenmann >talk 16:03, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Nirad Solanki

[edit]
Nirad Solanki (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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There is a lot of refbombing in this orphan article. Whilst a lot of the coverage confirms he bought businesses and bars, none of this is indepth to meet WP:SIGCOV. Just a run of the mill businessman that doesn't meet WP:BIO. LibStar (talk) 02:20, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Businesspeople, Food and drink, and England. LibStar (talk) 02:20, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete agree, while it states At the start of December in 2020, Solanki made headlines in both local newspapers and national newspapers where he gained recognition and publicity for applying to convert the ex-Wetherspoons bar, The New Baron of Hinckley, into a place of worship all the citations refer to syndicated articles by the same group of newspapers, with the same authors. Orange sticker (talk) 10:24, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Rabih Bou Rached

[edit]
Rabih Bou Rached (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Promotional BLP of a successful businessman with no real claim of notability. Various non notable awards and ROTM coverage in the form of interviews and PR profiles. Mccapra (talk) 19:52, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Miraboi

[edit]
Miraboi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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A biographical article about a Nigeria man that doesn't meet WP:GNG. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 19:18, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Jayati Devi

[edit]
Jayati Devi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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No indication that this person is notable per the current sourcing (which is not significant coverage), nor by her association with her husband, nor as a model/artist/musician. The article is part of a walled garden about the Munshi/Munsi extended family. A BEFORE search revealed nothing about this Jayati Devi (only about others). Fails WP:GNG and WP:CREATIVE. Bringing it here for the community to decide. Netherzone (talk) 15:57, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Neal Asbury

[edit]
Neal Asbury (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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After almost 14 years, the articles claims of notability are not backed up by the reliable and verifiable sources that would be required, nor was I able to find anything meaningful in a Google search that could be added. The article is an orphan and there appear to be no meaningful connections to any other article that would help flesh out a claim of notability. Alansohn (talk) 12:53, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Lukas Biewald

[edit]
Lukas Biewald (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Already did a cleanup of the article, but I do not think it meets the required depth of WP:BIO. I would suggest redirecting to Figure Eight Inc. which is the notable company he co-founded. PhotographyEdits (talk) 12:59, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Emperor Geezy

[edit]
Emperor Geezy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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This fails WP:NCREATIVE, and overall, WP:GNG based on WP:SIGCOV and WP:MILL. The award they won is not significant enough to help them pass, if they had 'won' their 'nomination's, that would be a different case, just merely being nominated at NEA isn't significant enough. The noms are unsourced while the piece the award they won is sourced to is an unreliable one from a marginally reliable publication (WP:NGRS). Taking a close look at the sources, they are mostly WP:RUNOFTHEMILL and unreliable pieces and do not provide WP:SIGCOV. I am skeptical about the notability of G-Worldwide Entertainment itself. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 15:42, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. Passes WP:SIGCOV(both in the Nigerian media and in foreign ones). At least you can look at the Nigerian Wikipedia article and find several sources. I’m not sure about WP:NMUSIC, but it’s not the main criteria anyway. Tau Corvi (talk) 08:43, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Tau Corvi You clearly don't know how the general notability guideline works. For an subject to have a standalone page on Wikipedia, they have to be the subject of discussions from multiple secondary sources that are independent of the subject, reliable and provides a substantial coverage of the subject. These are needed to pass WP:GNG, a subject doesn't just pass SIGCOV to qualify for a standalone page. Even the SIGCOV you claim it passes is even not exactly correct because that is not the case. I understand you're a new user, you may need to familiarise yourself with the policies and guidelines before venturing into AfDs. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 09:49, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment : If an Award has been reviewed, has a Wikipedia page and meets the WP:GNG then it’s notable. But reference from reliable source that are independent of the subject are needed to be cited for proof. The fact he has Won, being Nominated for notable awards, contributed to the notable movie Suga Suga (film) as an executive producer makes him passes WP:ANYBIO and notable. Per source cited on the article, subject passes WP:GNG. If the award section can be addressed then my vote is a Keep. Please to the AFD nominator theirs no point responding to me. I’m not here to argue unreasonably or pick sides. My word still stands per Wikipedia article guideline.--Gabriel (talk to me ) 19:57, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 23:17, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Familial relationships of Errol Musk

[edit]
Familial relationships of Errol Musk (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Errol Musk is not in any way notable independent of his relation to Elon Musk. He ran for public office, but was never elected, but was only elected once to a local city council, he was an engineer, but didn't do anything of note. There is nothing about him is notable other than that he was the father of Elon Musk. Ergzay (talk) 01:46, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

He ran for public office, but was never elected That's actually not correct, he was elected in '72 and served until the 80s. His 1983 resignation was front page news. Feoffer (talk) 05:20, 12 July 2024 (UTC) [reply]
Ah I missed that, but that was a local city council. None of the people in my city council have wikipedia pages. Ergzay (talk) 06:29, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well he wasn't "just any" councilman, he was a vocally anti-apartheid English-speaking South African politician in 1972 Pretoria! Per Isaacson and many others, that's actually a really big deal in his time and place, but damned if I can find really good English-language sourcing which actually deep-dives into that part of his life story. Feoffer (talk) 11:40, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It could be great if there is a comparison on how vocal he was compared to the famous Helen Suzman. Sir Kenneth Kho (talk) 13:12, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Is there a wikipedia page on even the contents of that 1972 city council? Did that 1972 city council do anything of note? Ergzay (talk) 00:17, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete: Errol Musk does not meet the notability guidelines despite his connection with Elon Musk. His career achievements and political work are not notable on their own. His main claim to fame is that he is the father of Elon Musk. It's crucial to adhere to WP:BLP, and keeping a separate article about only Musk's family does not meet these standards.--AstridMitch (talk) 02:14, 12 July 2024 (UTC) [reply]
  • Delete. Ridiculous to have an article about someone's "familial relationships" without giving him his own article. Astaire (talk) 02:38, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Well, it's like when we do "Death of so-and-so" for notable deaths. It's a reminder to readers that the current article doesn't (yet) cover Errol's political career in the depth required of a true BLP. Feoffer (talk) 05:25, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    A familial relationships article for Elon Musk would be more sane, in which case Errol Musk could be mentioned there, though I'd think it should still be just part of the Elon Musk article. Ergzay (talk) 06:30, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Well that's an excellent point. I definitely think of it as a Elon sub-article: we don't need to litigate emerald mines and spousal abuse and false claims of funding or abandonment on Elon's literal BLP. Feoffer (talk) 06:52, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I don't understand what you mean by "Elon sub-article". If it's not valuable enough to put on the page on Elon Musk then it's probably not valuable enough to put on any page on Wikipedia. I'm not sure on this last point, but I think "biography of living persons" policies apply even if it's a spin-off of the main article. That's not a loophole of the rule. Ergzay (talk) 00:26, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    From WP:BLP:

    BLP applies to all material about living persons anywhere on Wikipedia, including talk pages, edit summaries, user pages, images, categories, lists, article titles and drafts.

    Ergzay (talk) 00:33, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    BLP absolutely applies to ALL articles, I just meant we shouldn't be covering a notable abuser on one of their victim's biographical articles. Feoffer (talk) 14:25, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep as creator. GNG is met, he's been covered extensively in the press and in-depth in at least two different books. Ultimately, it's not fair to Maye Musk or Elon Musk to document Errol's extensive controversial public behavior on those articles, but neither is it fair to them for us simply to delete that verified information from the project. I haven't found fulltext access, but Afrikaans newspaper archive searches and the Isaacson book show Errol was a VERY notable person during his political career, long before Elon was an adult. Errol has a second claim to notability for his allegedly abusive relationships with Maye and Elon. Finally, Errol again became controversial for a marriage to a former stepdaughter (cf Soon-Yi Previn). Feoffer (talk) 04:58, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Businesspeople, Politicians, Engineering, and South Africa. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 05:51, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Even if this was notable, having it as a "familial relationships of" article makes 0 sense when it is basically a biography of him (focusing on his relationships because that's all the sources talk about!)
The only thing here that's not directly related to, or from publications about, Elon or his ex wife is the "having a child with his stepdaughter" thing which is not enough to have an article on PARAKANYAA (talk) 06:07, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Your words carry lots of weight with me. Are you saying we should just move this content into a BLP titled Errol Musk? And if not, do you have an opinion on where we SHOULD cover what is known about Errol? We've got 4 different BLPs from folks reliably alleging abuse at Errol's hands. I know @Ergzay: expressed a preference for covering it at Elon's BLP, but it seems unfair to me to single out one victim like that, when it's a multidecade pattern of abuse that pre- and post- dated Elons interactions. Errol's later promotion of conspiracy theories and admission of fathering multiple children with a stepchild obviously lend credence to their prior allegations. Feoffer (talk) 10:57, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, if there's to be something here, it should be a BLP. The content in this article is basically a BLP already. I believe there was already an AfD for the initial Errol Musk article though.
An alternative could be some sort of... Musk family article? I mean, his family's certainly discussed and he's certainly not the only notable member. Singling out his dad, who does not have his own article, for an article to be based around, doesn't make much sense. But if it's notable as part of his whole family then maybe, idk.
I'm not sure if either of these ideas are good, though, or if either is notable. Your point about his political career making him notable is a possibility but until sigcov related to that is presented the jury's still out. Not impossible though. PARAKANYAA (talk) 11:28, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you so much for this feedback.
I probably should have said somewhere that this article was created to hold content removed in Musk family (which was deleted on June 1) which had been merged from Errol Musk (merged into Musk Family in Sept 2023). I concur that a full BLP should wait for the South African source, but in the mean time, the victims really do deserve for it to be SOMEWHERE in Wikipedia.(/?) Feoffer (talk) 11:51, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Wikipedia is not in the business of deciding what people "deserve". Please read WP:RGW. Astaire (talk) 12:24, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Lol fair enough, I'm not on a crusade. but it's still verifiable content with exculpatory BLP implications for Elon and Maye. Feoffer (talk) 12:56, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Some of this content may belong somewhere on Wikipedia, but the current article is too flawed to stand. If it is really about "familial relationships", why does it discuss his business career, his election to city council and his game lodge? Why should anyone care that Errol claimed that Elon upgraded his home security system? Astaire (talk) 13:09, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Why should anyone care that Errol claimed that Elon upgraded his home security system?
Because it contradicts the false claims in media (sourced to Errol) of Elon's supposed abandonment of a disabled parent. Feoffer (talk) 13:19, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Including that content with that justification is a WP:OR issue, unless reliable sources explicitly note the contradiction themselves. Astaire (talk) 13:36, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, any answer to your question about "why should anyone care" would be OR to put in article unless it was explicitly noted in RS. Feoffer (talk) 08:54, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Draftify Weird article. Creator claims that there is more coverage of him out there, so I don't think a full delete is warranted. Either way, the article is not ready for mainspace. If the consensus ends up being to delete, that would be fine by me. BottleOfChocolateMilk (talk) 06:28, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Draftify or Delete I'm the one who submitted this, but I'm fine with either option. It doesn't make sense to have it as an article though. I'm not sure what moving it to a Draft could fix though. Ergzay (talk) 06:35, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I interpret draftify calls as me having jumped the gun by publishing it in mainspace before we got access to the sources on political career needed to make a full balanced BLP. I get it's an unorthodox title, but it's also a little bit of a blpvio to not document Errol's verifiably-checkered past somewhere, given his public attacks on family. I don't feel good about stuffing it all into the BLP of one of his victims. Feoffer (talk) 11:09, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    The title is probably the biggest problem. Having an articles about the familial relationships of someone without having an article on the person themselves is a bit ridiculous. But there's lots of other issues beyond that, even if the page was moved, like the noteworthiness of the man himself and of anything he thinks beyond it's relation to Elon Musk. Ergzay (talk) 00:20, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Draftify Plenty of notable source material for an article about the man more so than his "relations", especially since Musk Family got effectively yeeted. QRep2020 (talk) 16:23, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep and rename as Errol Musk - Numerous sources discuss his own life, so that his bio would easily pass GNG. Surely his son's fame directed attention to him, just like Maye Musk, Kimbal Musk and Tosca Musk; we've got plenty of coverage for those individuals as well, who arguably wouldn't be notably featured in the press if Elon's life hadn't attracted so much scrutiny. Ironic that notability is not inherited, though in this case the hyper-notability of one person did engender notability of various family members... — JFG talk 10:34, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 06:55, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Roger Rohatgi

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Roger Rohatgi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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There is not a single direct and in-depth independent secondary article about him. Seems very non-notable business executive, clergy, motivational speaker. WorthWobble (talk) 12:06, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The CDO of bp, #22 in the Fortune 500, is non-notable figure? 98.118.86.149 (talk) 17:40, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Without sourcing, yes. Oaktree b (talk) 22:46, 11 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, hi. I'm new to Wikipedia and I'm just getting my feet wet. I've gone through the tutorials, but I have some questions. Please be patient as I work to better understand, because I'm a bit confused about notability and primary vs. secondary sources.
For example, his link is not enough because it is just stuff from his wiki entry, which is referenced in his profile :https://www.ranker.com/review/roger-rohatgi/33496792?l=101186
This link doesn't work because it isn't an article, just a profile, even though it was a talk run by Harvard Business Review: https://www.alumni.hbs.edu/events/leading-with-ai.aspx
This link isn't enough because it isn't about him, even though he was a speaker for the economist, is this correct?https://viterbischool.usc.edu/news/2023/10/usc-viterbi-at-the-economist-space-economy-summit-in-los-angeles/
This video doesn't work because it is a primary source, as it is a recording of him speaking
This is a secondary source, but because he is only mentioned as a speaker, but it isn't about him, this wouldn't make the cut, correct? https://medium.com/techsonar/my-thoughts-on-the-iot-world-and-ai-summit-2022-in-austin-tx-131addde76b2
This article is an interview with him, which makes it Primary, even though there is a transcript. Are transcripts primary or secondary? https://www.designit.com/stories/point-of-view/design-the-future-featuring-roger-rohatgi
As a follow up to the above link, it is also a Podcast where he is brought on to be interviewed. That makes the Podcast primary, correct?
This blurb is technically a secondary source, but it has information that can be found elsewhere. What I mean is: I've read this while searching for these links. It is too short to count, right? https://augmentedenterprisesummit.com/speakers/2024-roger-rohatgi/
Same for this, correct? https://www.rca.ac.uk/research-innovation/research-centres/helen-hamlyn-centre/session-6-social-sustainability-the-role-of-inclusive-design/
This is too close because he literally works at bp: https://www.bp.com/en/global/corporate/careers/life-at-bp/our-stories/rogers-story.html
I'm not saying that this is a great example, but would this be a secondary source?
I apologize for the wall of text, but since there were vet editors here, I thought I should ask. These links were found with ChatGPT, but Wikipedia editing is my new rabbit hole :) Illunadin (talk) 20:42, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, sorry. One last question. This is secondary, but it doesn't actually provide much ABOUT him, just what he said. Should these be considered? https://www.wired.com/story/fast-forward-the-chatbots-are-now-talking-to-each-other/ Illunadin (talk) 20:55, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Same as above. It mentions his job and role, but it isn't about him in particular, correct? https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/blog/2024/01/24/bring-virtual-connections-to-life-with-microsoft-mesh-now-generally-available-in-microsoft-teams/ Illunadin (talk) 20:56, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Malinaccier (talk) 15:52, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Serik Tolbassy

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Serik Tolbassy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Reviewed during NPP. No indication of wp:notability or SNG. All resume type material with promotional type wording, plus material on companies and organizations that he is affiliated with. Of the 4 references, one is a brief bio, 2 have just mentions of him at an event and one is a forbes listing of him being the 26th or 56th richest man in Kazakhstan. Tagged by others since January. North8000 (talk) 20:31, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 22:47, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Faris Mannekkara

[edit]
Faris Mannekkara (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Likely to fail WP:NBIO - sourced to PR/puff pieces.
Earlier draft: Draft:Muhammed Faris Mannekkara KH-1 (talk) 00:50, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep Although the editor who made this page did a mistake by creating a draft and then again creating it into the main space, maybe he is a newbie that's why....but if we look at the person's page, he was awarded the community Leader Award from the Kerala State Women's Development Corporation which is a state award from the person's home state which is in Kerala and the Fulbright Foundation’s Global Changemaker Award in 2023 which is a International award given by the US Government which i believe at least qualify the award category of the people's notability guidelines according to the guidelines written in Wikipedia. This guy also has a significant coverage in The Times of India, Economics Times , Ahmedabad Mirror which i believe is considered reliable in Wikipedia. So we have 2 of the 3 basic criteria except the national dictionary thing ....also While reading the content of these articles i don't see any kind of sponsored post written or a disclaimer in the news coverage these are just my analysis. SATavr (talk) 16:19, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    It may be ignorance / new editor who wrote the draft and then made a new page, but destroyed the first edits in the first draft and deleted it in a completely unrecognizable form, added another person to it and added it to his date of birth and created a misunderstanding because of lack of knowledge?? Draft:Muhammed Faris Mannekkara Difference between revisions [9], Draft:Muhammed Faris Mannekkara 2nd Difference between revisions[10] Spworld2 (talk) 06:03, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Yes, I do agree with you. It was a stupid mistake done by this new editor and i think he lacks the patience for it and just wanted to go directly with a shortcut way for publication. Thats why he change the draft content to a different person and he thought we would'nt know lol..... I believe he has learned a lesson not to do it again and i hope he has got to know that things doesnt workout like this. SATavr (talk) 09:10, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
PR/churnalism doesn’t count. Both articles are just advertorials for his car company.-KH-1 (talk) 10:37, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
These articles discuss his side automobile firm, yet his Wikipedia biography hardly ever mentions this information. The autogenerated nature of these stories is not disclaimed, as is typically the case. The name of the publisher, Sunil Chaurasia, is also mentioned in The Economic Times. His social work is the subject of major pieces that don't appear to be PR or churnalism. They include original research, such as his participation in and thorough coverage of the Sankesh Foundation and the Smiles Foundation. - [3] which is covered in the Ahmedabad Mirror. Another example is his relationship with Shyalash C, his mentor, which isn't mentioned on his Wikipedia page but is confirmed as original research in Punjab Kesari - [4]. Tiger-in-Action (talk) 09:09, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting. It would be nice to hear from some more experienced editors about whether sourcing is sufficient to establish notability.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 01:04, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Keep The person is currently serving as a Global Peace Ambassador under UN75. He has been awarded the Fulbright Award and a State Government Award from Kerala. He meets the basic criteria of WP:GNG and WP:BIO. With regards to his sources the news articles on his social work looks fine but the same cannot be said for some of his articles written about his second-hand car business found in google but considering that his Wikipedia page does not cover his car business, overall, it looks fine to me. Master rollo (talk) 11:29, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: I am seriously asking for experienced editors who frequent AFD discussions to review this article.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 00:39, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Delete: I only get two pages of Gnews results, most are by "staff" or puff pieces/advertorials. The Fullbright sounds promising, but without sourcing we can't confirm, nor do we have enough for notability. Oaktree b (talk) 00:51, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Best I could find was this [11]; GTranslate seems to say it's a staff piece, so likely about as unreliable as the rest of what's already in the article. Oaktree b (talk) 00:52, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I would suggest searching by his full name, Muhammad Faris Mannekkara, to find additional articles about him. Also, please check the sources listed on his Wikipedia page. it maybe possible that his articles are ranked poorly in google search engine. that's why less result are been shown but if you try his full name which act like a keyword you will find the news article. Regarding his Fulbright award, it is published in this source as well. [5].
    When i am doing the Google Translate for this article - [3] it is referring the person as "she" instead of "He" and is not translating the words in a properly manner. Also the article mentions the author's name as well - Gaurav Tiwari which means it contradict the claim that it was written by multiple staff. Also there aren't any disclaimer that says this story is autogenerated. Blackwatch007 (talk) 15:44, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Joseph James Nantomah

[edit]
Joseph James Nantomah (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Life coach, serial entrepreneur, but I don't see any significant independent coverage. The only articles I see are praising the guy's amazing skills in his voice. BrigadierG (talk) 09:18, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

These three sources are not included in the article. Best, Reading Beans 10:31, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 07:20, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete We have independent coverage requirements to pass notability, and I don't see it on these sources. The links in the article, as well as the additional links suggested by @Reading Beans do read as if they were pulled by a self-penned biography package. If you look at the PM News article from a certain angle it looks like independent reporting, possibly just paraphrasing/rewriting but more of an editorial effort. Oblivy (talk) 10:30, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Oblivy, I usually and always disapprove of badgering of !votes but what is the proof of the non-independency of these sources? The tone? I just want to naively believe that it’s the tone. But is it? Best, Reading Beans 14:51, 9 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's the way the articles just say things about him, often things that only he would know or which would be difficult to track down. And doing so without any of the the curiosity or skepticism or contextualization one might expect from an independent journalistic exercise. Oblivy (talk) 00:57, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This may sound WP:OR but there are a lot, I mean, a lot interviews out there. Do you prefer I cite interviews (which I think is where these informations were actually gotten)? As I said earlier, we always make a mistake of judging sources from Africa with Western standards. Best, Reading Beans 09:12, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
For the information, I am from Nigeria. Best, Reading Beans 09:12, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
If you have other sources that qualify for WP:GNG feel free to add them or cite them here. I had a look at each of the existing sources, plus the ones you selected above, and made my vote based on what I saw - a bunch of puff pieces and an article announcing he got an honorary degree from an unaccredited college. This has nothing to do with misapplying Western standards. Oblivy (talk) 09:32, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: Sometimes we follow the content of the article, which most often appears promotional though can be cleaned easily. Others will leave WP:GNG, and rush to additional criteria that can presume notability. However, this context presents a good narrative of the subject. It's also unfortunate that this generation will neglect someone being a migration officer (formed word) or copy writer, but in the olden days, we see people being that and still appear on sources like the current generation. No matter the promotional (which I don't seem to find) contents in he article, it doesn't depict the fact of being notable, or treated in multiple independent sources. I first was following the discussion especially when it found this article by Vanguard as a well written non advertorial source, and it prompted me reading others. Here is my conclusion, the three Nigerian sources are all reliable per WP:NGRS, and is very satisfiable for WP:GNG. Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 19:37, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: The subject has received coverage in multiple reliable sources, including the ones posted here by RB. The article meets WP:GNG, and sources are fine from here. Comr Melody Idoghor (talk) 19:28, 15 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: We have very divergent opinions on the adequacy of sources on this subject. Before closing this as No consensus, I'll try one more relisting to see if we can iron out the differences in assessment of them.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 06:14, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Comment: Reason for notability seems unclear in the article. Additionally, the sources are questionable in my mind. For example, the first source has a banner asking people to join their Whatsapp group and the third and fourth sources have links to their Whatsapp group. The The third and fourth sources also link to the same website, tribuneonlineng.com. The method of contacting pmnewsnigeria.com, the second source, is a Google Form, which seems unprofessional for an independent news site. Ternera (talk) 15:51, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    If you think Nigerian national dailies should not be cited, you should state so. Most news outlets do this in Nigeria (as a way of driving traffic) but this does not affect their editorial policy. If you have any issues save for this, please, let me know. Best, Reading Beans 19:59, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    The group even doesn't allow anybody except admins post anything. Likewise the subscription of newspapers in Europe and America, that's a good way for Nigerian sources that doesn't seek subscription. Haven't I seen such in American newspapers even? Welp, those doesn't affect the contents published by the newspaper—editorial policy like Reading Beans said. We look at the established reliable source, and how independent the content they published seems to look. Cheers! Safari ScribeEdits! Talk! 14:05, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Ternera I will understand why you’re a bit confused here. How or where newspapers choose to be contacted from or whether a newspaper has a link to their WhatsApp channel is not in any way unprofessional. These publications can choose to put links to any of their social media, it is all part of their social media marketing strategies. All these,
    you just mentioned, do not count in determining whether a source or piece is reliable, that’s not what you look at. Don’t be distracted by whether they have links to their WhatsApp channel or not or if they decide to use google forms for contact. FUN FACT: A lot of websites integrate google forms backend for their contacts page, that is not in any way unprofessional. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 07:38, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Moruf Oseni

[edit]
Moruf Oseni (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)
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Procedural nom following the discussion at Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2024 June 19 where consensus was that the speedy wasn't the right outcome, but did not necessarily find support for retention and the outcome was for an AfD to establish consensus. Note I have dropped the protection to ECP to allow established editors to improve the article if they feel so inclined as it didn't feel right to have a fully protected article at AfD. However if p-blocks or other solutions are needed, feel free to implement them. I have not protected the AfD out of hope that all editors will work productively. Star Mississippi 13:29, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

What is the main issue with the page? Are other editors citing any apart from the G11 on the Achievements and Awards section mentioned in the deletion review? @Star Mississippi Michael Ugbodu (talk) 23:01, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I have no opinion on the merit @Michael Ugbodu, I just nominated it as the outcome of the DRV. Star Mississippi 01:35, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Tentative cautious keep. It appears this article has a history of ping-ponging between draft space and mainspace, with promotional tone, COI/UPE(?) editing issues, and initially unclear claims of significance/notability. As such it deserves scrutiny. (As an aside, it sounded from DRV there might be information about this on the article's talk page, but this has not been undeleted). That said, earlier this month Michael Ugbodu (who I understand may be an involved editor?) added additional sources which point to achievements and awards that present a credible assertion of significance. In such cases, there are sometimes concerns if the sourcing (and awards) themselves are sufficiently independent, i.e. editorially independent vs regurgitating primary sources only. I'm not familiar with Nigerian sourcing, so don't have a good opinion on this. However, while the process followed with this article has been irregular and far from good practice, absent credible assertions to the contrary, it does seem there is adequate 3rd party coverage, sourcing, and notability to warrant an article. Martinp (talk) 11:08, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks for flagging the lack of talk page @Martinp. Oversight on my part. It's now undeleted Star Mississippi 12:34, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Now that I've reviewed the talk page, and read the DRV in more detail, I'm changing to delete, send back to draft and enforce requiring using WP:AFC to recreate by any COI editors. I applaud @Michael Ugbodu for their clear statement of COI on the talk page, and for hunting up promising sources. However, paid editing COI should also be listed on the editor's user talk page, and paid-COI article drafts are indeed supposed to go through WP:AFC, not be promoted into mainspace by a COI editor. This is not just bureaucracy, it is exactly there where independence of sources, article bias, etc can be reviewed best, insulating from the fact that a paid-COI editor has much more energy to argue than uncompensated volunteers if there is any debate. We've now had (at least) multiple days at DRV and now 2.5 days here where no-one independent has truly investigated notability and independence of the secondary sources used. Given the COI, this is a must, and while it may be frustrating to a paid editor and their client to have to wait, it would equally be unfair to keep this article in mainspace absent someone independent, experienced with local (Nigerian) sourcing, to verify, jumping the queue vs other paid articles that are going through the (admittedly clogged) AFC pipeline. I'm happy to change my vote if someone independent does investigate those sources during the rest of this AFD. Martinp (talk) 22:36, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We need to come to a consensus on the main issues with the page. The sources for the awards section are all newspaper sources and not primary sources, so can be considered credible. However, I think the second paragraph on the achievements section can be better written or scrapped as it sounds promotional.
Let's hear what others think as well. Michael Ugbodu (talk) 22:22, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • It's trickier, Michael. We have a lot of trouble with CV-like COI articles which do use secondary (newspaper) sources, but they are not sufficiently independent of the article subject. I'm (probably) not notable in wikispeak, but would not become so just because I persuaded a newspaper (or two) to run an article where they just parroted what I told them. That's why we need someone who doesn't have a COI to look into that (I can't, since I know nothing about Nigerian newspaper writing habits!) Martinp (talk) 22:39, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Doczilla Ohhhhhh, no! 10:22, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, The Herald (Benison) (talk) 18:36, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

List
Here's the address the subject presumably lacking GNG.
The GNG guidelines include:
“Independent Coverage” - "There is significant coverage in reliable sources": The subject has sources from Reliable sources like CNBC Africa, Punch Newspapers, Leadership Newspapers, This Day Live, Business Day, The Guardian Nigeria, and New Telegraph.
"Significant coverage" - “Significant coverage is more than a trivial mention, but it does not need to be the main topic of the source material”: The article has a mix of coverage that are focused on the subject and others that support and are not "trivial mentions". All articles referenced have a good amount of coverage of the subject. The section with the least amount of coverage would be the 'Awards section' which goes to show that it wasn't paid for as if it were paid for, more coverage would be seen.
“Sources should be secondary": All sources listed in the article are secondary sources
"Independent of the subject": There is no Advertising, Press Release, Autobiography, or Subject website content on the article. Anybody who feels there is one should please specifically point it out so it can be removed. If the 'Awards' section is deemed too promotional and not having significant coverage, by all means let's take out that section. An entire article doesn't have to be discarded because a particular section has issues. That's why discussions like these were created.
Being a paid editor isn't against Wikipedia rules and shouldn't bring bias to discussions like this. The question is "does the subject pass the GNG? Is the article good enough for mainspace? Is there anything that can be done to improve it for mainspace?" That's what should be the focus, not just going ahead to have it deleted. It is clear that the subject has notability from all the references cited. The Bank of which the subject is CEO of, Wema Bank, is on Wikipedia as well. Michael Ugbodu (talk) 09:47, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. My reasons are stated above Michael Ugbodu (talk) 15:10, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Weak Keep Article needs to be re-written with proper sources. I will recommend the article is adopted by a competent writer, and rewritten because i can posit the individual does not lack GNG. Currently, the article looks promotional. I recommend it is opened for general editing. Pshegs (talk) 16:35, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Generally lack GNG and the reliable sources has no significant coverage

DXdy FX (talk) 22:33, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • [This was made in response to a comment, listing a cross-section of references from the article, that's now been changed.] Seriously? 1 [CNBC Africa] has no coverage of the man. 2 [Premium Times] and 4 [Business Day] are copies of the same press release, also appearing e.g. here and here. 3 [Leadership Newspaper] is entirely a quoted press release. 5 [also Leadership Newspaper] is another unmarked press release, as also seen for example here, here, and here. 6 [Guardian Nigeria] also has no biographical coverage, merely a few quotes.
    If you think these constitute GNG-satisfying coverage, I have to ask: are you, like every other editor who has taken an interest in this page, being paid to do so, or are you merely incompetent? —Cryptic 22:10, 13 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I checked very they are all press releases. The subject generally has no notability. I think I’ll change my vote to delete right now. DXdy FX (talk) 21:27, 16 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete not ready, lacks notability. --BoraVoro (talk) 13:08, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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